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example.com330 points · 186 comments · 6 years ago · dewey
saurik
keyme
This particular case is also outrageous for other reasons:
1) They are only doing this now because Corellium has been selling virtually the same thing for a while already.
2) They are doing this to try and hurt Corellium financially, while they're already suing them in parallel.
3) Agreeing to their terms here, effectively makes you a glorified Apple QA engineer. Only you don't get a salary, but rather, a bounty for whenever you find a bug. For most people that would be way, way less money than just being employed wherever.
shantara
If you report a vulnerability affecting Apple products, Apple will provide you with a publication date... Until the publication date, you cannot discuss the vulnerability with others.
In addition to the mandatory bug reporting, Apple reserve a right to dictate the researchers a mandatory publication date. No more 90/180 days responsible disclosure deadline policy. I highly doubt any serious researcher would agree to work with such conditions.
guidovranken
If you use the SRD to find, test, validate, verify, or confirm a vulnerability, you must promptly report it to Apple and, if the bug is in third-party code, to the appropriate third party. If you didn’t use the SRD for any aspect of your work with a vulnerability, Apple strongly encourages (and rewards, through the Apple Security Bounty) that you report the vulnerability, but you are not required to do so.
So vulnerabilities found through this program are not eligible for any reward. Then what would be the incentive to enroll (and accepting liabilities like losing the device, Apple suspecting you of breach of contract etc)? Just bragging rights?
natvert
This is huge. Not as a security device, but if this were the normal permission model on all iPhones (e.g. owners of devices get root on the devices they own... like a normal general purpose computing device) I could ditch my android and my mac and use an iPhone for everything.
I'm not saying this will ever happen, but in my mind this paints a bright picture of what the iPhone could be.
It's also a bit sobering as I'm quite concerned Apple is actually pushing the other direction in their shift from Intel to ARM.
jedieaston
Also, if you found an exploit on a research iPhone because you made use of entitlements that were Apple-only, I wonder if that'd be worth anything bounty wise. Nobody can/should be able to write an that'll get through App Store checks if they asked for PLZ_NO_SANDBOX_ILL_BE_GOOD or something (at least, that's what I thought before the whole Snapchat system call thing happened). But hypothetically the App Store review process is vulnerable to a bad actor inside Apple pushing an update to a big app that included malware, so I'd think that private entitlements shouldn't be available at all to binaries that didn't ship with the device/in a system update (unless some kind of hobbyist flag was flipped by the consumer). So I'd say that would be worth something, even if smaller than a more interesting exploit.
saagarjha
If you use the SRD to find, test, validate, verify, or confirm a vulnerability, you must promptly report it to Apple and, if the bug is in third-party code, to the appropriate third party.
I mean, if I find a bug I might report it, but I know people who work on jailbreaks and stuff–if they tell me something will I have to promptly report it? What if I find something on a non-SRD device? If I ever hypothetically "write a jailbreak", will Apple come after me even if I say I didn't use that device for it? I can get 90% of the benefit from using a device with a bootroom exploit, with none of the restrictions here…
ebg13
If you use the SRD to find, test, validate, verify, or confirm a vulnerability, you must promptly report it to Apple
But let's say you pass their review, get a device, find a vulnerability, and don't report it. Then what? You're breaching the contract, but they have no way to know that, so there's no consequence?
brutopia
ChrisMarshallNY
For example, if the OS isn't quite at the same level as the release OS, it could be an issue.
That said, this is not my field, and I am not qualified to offer much more than the vague speculation, above.
dpifke
gowld
hendersoon
On the bright side, it will be very useful for jailbreak research and in a way, those bugs _do_ get disclosed to Apple for them to subsequently fix. Not necessarily the way Apple wants, but it does shine daylight on their code.
These guys keep working exploits close to their hearts and don't release them specifically so they can get a look at new hardware. That will no longer be necessary. You find an exploit, you can release it right away.
And on the gripping hand, it will also be used by malicious criminals and state actors to develop zero days for various evil purposes.
The real problem here is that Apple is so ridiculously controlling with respect to who is allowed to develop software (in Apple's perfect world, all software development would require an Apple license and all software would require Apple review)--in a legal area that isn't really conducive to that (see Sega v. Accolade, which was important enough to later ensure permanent exemptions on reverse engineering and even jailbreaking for software interoperability purposes in the original DMCA anti-tampering laws)--that they are even working right now on suing Corellium, a company which makes an iPhone emulator (which again, has strong legal precedent), in order to prevent anyone but a handful of highly controlled people from being able to debug their platform.
Apple just has such a history of being anti-security researcher--banning people like Charlie Miller from the App Store for showing faults in their review process, pulling the vulnerability detection app from Stefan Esser, slandering Google Project Zero, denying the iPhone 11 location tracking until proven wrong, requiring people in their bug bounty program to be willing to irresponsibly hold bugs indefinitely so Apple can fix things only at their leisure, and using the DMCA to try to squelch research via takedowns--that this ends up feeling like yet another flat gesture: they should have done much more than this device at least a decade ago. I'd say Apple is in store for a pretty big fall if anyone ever manages to get a bankroll large enough to actually fight them in court for any protracted length of time :/.